You CAN'T obtain new Skills when you play MYFAROG!

[shameonyou]

My question is, isn't your character able to obtain new Skills?? Why? It just looks strange. For example, there is a rule that if you have the Civilian Character Role it means you can choose 6 skills for your character. Don't forget that you choose 2 of 3 Skills as Trained Skills based on the birthplace of your hero. It's if your character is male. Three Skills from 9 Skills if your character is female. After that, you choose 4 more Untrained Skills. But there are some troubles there.



First of all, you also choose a Talent. You should pick some Untrained Skill or Skills, which will connect with your Talent somehow. In another case, your Talent is useless for some time in a game. I mean if you don't pick certain Skills to a Talent. Moreover, there's zero skills of a character in your Character Sheet by default. Only 3 Skills in your Skill list are presented as permanent Skills. They are 'Dodging', 'Perception' and 'Tempo'. Next, if you have those 2 Trained Skills then you need to pick 4 more skills. At least you choose 'Stamina' and 'Mêlèe' Skills anyway! If you don't choose them, hence you won't be able to use melee weapons and even walk! Lack of the latter makes you without Stamina Points! Okay, 4 - 2 ('Stamina' and 'Mêlèe'. It's just crucial!) = 2 Skills. Next, it's highly possible that you will need to choose some Skill or even Skills in relation to your Talent! I.e. you choose 'Herbalist' Talent (+ 1 'Alchemy' & 'Foraging'), that means you pick 'Alchemy' and 'Foraging' as your Untrained Skills. 2 - 2 = 0 Skills. There are not so many options.



When you take a new Character Role, other than the Civilian, you receive a set of Skills that some Character Role already has. But those Character Roles don't have all the necessary Skills you need for a game in Thule. A Ranger doesn't have the 'Riding' Skill and you have already made your choice:



i. Your character was born in Akadê, so 'Crafts' and 'Acting' in your Skill list, for example.

ii. You chose the 'Herbalist' Talent (+ 1 'Alchemy' & 'Foraging')

iii. Also, you picked 'Stamina', 'Mêlèe' (because it's crucial), 'Alchemy', 'Foraging' (because of that Talent).

iv. Statistics of your character make him able to become a Ranger.

v. Ranger's Skill set is:



1. Acrobatics

2. Foraging (This skill becomes a Trained Skill only for you who are a Ranger. We remove 'Foraging' from a Skill list of your character who was a Civilian for some time)

3. Healing

4. Navigation

5. Poetry

6. Religious Tradition

7. Stamina (This skill becomes a Trained Skill only for you who are a Ranger. We remove 'Foraging' from a Skill list of your character who was a Civilian for some time)

8. Stealth

9. Swimming
10. Tracking



You know, I even have the second question after this reasoning. This question is if we included 'Foraging' and 'Stamina' Skills into the Skill set of your character, who is only being a Ranger now (we remove 'Foraging', 'Stamina' from Skill set of your Civilian character), so does it mean there is two empty gaps anew after removing? I mean, can you choose something instead of 'Foraging' and 'Stamina' again?? I think...maybe the answer is no, because a Civilian hero can have 4 Untrained Skills (and those 2 or 3 Trained Skills additionally) and when your Civilian character becomes a Ranger he isn't a Civilian anymore. Well, you can't use that option to choose two other Untrained Skills anew probably.



Nevertheless, you are a Ranger presently and a full Skill set of your character is ready for now. The complete list of your Skills is:



1. Crafts (Trained. No penalty.)

2. Acting (Trained. No penalty.)

3. Stamina (A Skill of Character Role. No penalty.)

4. Mêlèe (Untrained. Penalty)

5. Alchemy (Untrained. Penalty)

6. Foraging (A Skill of Character Role. No penalty.)

7. Acrobatics (A Skill of Character Role. No penalty.)

8. Healing (A Skill of Character Role. No penalty.)

9. Navigation (A Skill of Character Role. No penalty.)

10. Poetry (A Skill of Character Role. No penalty.)

11. Religious Tradition (A Skill of Character Role. No penalty.)

12. Stealth (A Skill of Character Role. No penalty.)

13. Swimming (A Skill of Character Role. No penalty.)

14. Tracking (A Skill of Character Role. No penalty.)

15. Dodging (is always included into a Skill set)

16. Perception (is always included into a Skill set)

17. Tempo (is always included into a Skill set)



Now, I can make my issue clear with it. The Experience Points paragraph (page 20) doesn't let us know that your character can obtain new Skills! I attached a screenshot with a piece of text from page 20 below this post.



So, why??? It just means that a Ranger won't be able to ride a horse or use Missile weapons at least. How is it? You live in the ancient era and you can't ride an animal?? It's strange. What looks more strange is that a Ranger can't use Missile weapons throughout all his life at all. Why not? It's possible he'll manage to study how to use Missile weapons at any point in the timeline of his life, isn't it? If he can't do it, it looks unrealistic. Also, I give only one possible example with Skills. I suppose it's possible you'll take another Skill mixture. Next, that mixture could make you confused about this issue that may appear suddenly.



At the end of this post I also send you a message about the Experience Points paragraph (page 20). That paragraph doesn't let us know a character can study new Skills when he achieves a New Level. But it doesn't help us to know that a character can't study new Skills at the same time. This fact makes the optional rule 'Ad Hoc Solutions' possible for using (page 48).



Well, what do you think, people?

[n/a]

In your post you seem to be suggesting a PC starts as a civilian, gets skills from that class, and then converts to a non-civilian and then gets skills from that.  It's an interesting idea but I don't think that is how it's meant to be used.  Character creation is you pick civilian OR a non-civilian role.  It would be a special case where you start as a civilian and move to a non-civilian role, or a case where you lose your class and become a civilian and somehow regain it again.

Why? Because your class is assigned upon entering manhood after going through the rebirth rites, not before.  A child is not a civilian.  A man is a civilian who does not get a class.  At least that is what I assume.

Nov 21, 2022 19:47:05 GMT shameonyou said:

My question is, isn't your character able to obtain new Skills??

"for every new level gained the player character can gain Training in a skill he is Untrained in" - p20

Nov 21, 2022 19:47:05 GMT shameonyou said:

You know, I even have the second question after this reasoning. This question is if we included 'Foraging' and 'Stamina' Skills into the Skill set of your character, who is only being a Ranger now (we remove 'Foraging', 'Stamina' from Skill set of your Civilian character), so does it mean there is two empty gaps anew after removing?

I think 'no' because on p18 "Losing your Character Role" it says that lost character skills are converted to trained skills. So with this reasoning a Civilian becoming a Ranger would convert his Civilian Character Skills to Trained Skills.

Nov 21, 2022 19:47:05 GMT shameonyou said:

Now, I can make my issue clear with it. The Experience Points paragraph (page 20) doesn't let us know that your character can obtain new Skills! I attached a screenshot with a piece of text from page 20 below this post.

It say you can get a skill every level right there on p20 what do you mean lol

Nov 21, 2022 19:47:05 GMT shameonyou said:

So, why??? It just means that a Ranger won't be able to ride a horse or use Missile weapons at least. How is it? You live in the ancient era and you can't ride an animal?? It's strange. What looks more strange is that a Ranger can't use Missile weapons throughout all his life at all. Why not?

In ancient Thule I don't think they rode many horses anyways, I recall V saying something about this on his old YT channel. However, I suspect you can ride one anyways, you just probably can't do advanced things with it like combat.

[n/a]

Nov 21, 2022 19:47:05 GMT shameonyou said:

At least you choose 'Stamina' and 'Mêlèe' Skills anyway! If you don't choose them, hence you won't be able to use melee weapons and even walk!

rotflmao

p34 says proficiency in stamina is 8+Con so even untrained you have stamina points.

but I like your interpretation maybe it should be a rule for drunk Thuleans lmao

Melee, yeah well that's expected you would suck with a sword if not trained in it.

[shameonyou]

Dec 4, 2022 22:24:43 GMT n/a said:

In your post you seem to be suggesting a PC starts as a civilian, gets skills from that class, and then converts to a non-civilian and then gets skills from that.  It's an interesting idea but I don't think that is how it's meant to be used.  Character creation is you pick civilian OR a non-civilian role.  It would be a special case where you start as a civilian and move to a non-civilian role, or a case where you lose your class and become a civilian and somehow regain it again.

Why? Because your class is assigned upon entering manhood after going through the rebirth rites, not before.  A child is not a civilian.  A man is a civilian who does not get a class.  At least that is what I assume.

  Actually, yes. A Civilian -> None- Civilian and if some skills of set of Skills of your non-Civilian Character are the same with those Skills your picked before then those several Skills should be converted into Skills of your none-Civilian Character Role only. You don't have two Riding Skills for example. I think so. 

First of all, you need to find every statistic for your character, pick a Talent and if you're Religious you need to choose your Deity. Before you complete these steps it's unknown which a Character Role suits your character according to your statistics and a favourite Deity (if you're Religious). Also, before you find out which a Character Role is for your character you still be a Civilian, because a Civilian is just a common man/woman. It's nothing special for a Civilian. Check out a page 21 of MYFAROG v.2.7, please. There is written that a Civilian is just any four skills of player's choice. So, when you just choose some Skills for your character and you don't know yet statistics of your hero enough for some Character Role, so before it your character is just a Civilian. Is it logical?

[shameonyou]

Dec 4, 2022 22:24:43 GMT n/a said:

Nov 21, 2022 19:47:05 GMT shameonyou said:

My question is, isn't your character able to obtain new Skills??

"for every new level gained the player character can gain Training in a skill he is Untrained in" - p20

Train an Untrained Skill it isn't the same with you obtain a new Skill. 

[shameonyou]

Dec 4, 2022 22:24:43 GMT n/a said:

Nov 21, 2022 19:47:05 GMT shameonyou said:

Now, I can make my issue clear with it. The Experience Points paragraph (page 20) doesn't let us know that your character can obtain new Skills! I attached a screenshot with a piece of text from page 20 below this post.

It say you can get a skill every level right there on p20 what do you mean lol

Ohh...I didn't notice that sentence. My bad. Now, I see you can obtain new Skills in a game.

[shameonyou]

Dec 4, 2022 22:35:10 GMT n/a said:

Nov 21, 2022 19:47:05 GMT shameonyou said:

At least you choose 'Stamina' and 'Mêlèe' Skills anyway! If you don't choose them, hence you won't be able to use melee weapons and even walk!

rotflmao

p34 says proficiency in stamina is 8+Con so even untrained you have stamina points.

but I like your interpretation maybe it should be a rule for drunk Thuleans lmao

Melee, yeah well that's expected you would suck with a sword if not trained in it.

Yes, you're right a proficiency of Stamina is 8 + Con. 

Page 34. Yeah, there is written that Stamina is 8 + Con. It's about how to understand and calculate your Stamina. But there is written nothing about it's a Skill of your character by default. There is only about how to understand how many points of Stamina you have when you obtain a Stamina Skill. So, it seems like you have 0 Skills at the beginning.



Actually, where's words in the text that you have some Skills by default?

[shameonyou]

Dec 4, 2022 22:24:43 GMT n/a said:

Nov 21, 2022 19:47:05 GMT shameonyou said:

So, why??? It just means that a Ranger won't be able to ride a horse or use Missile weapons at least. How is it? You live in the ancient era and you can't ride an animal?? It's strange. What looks more strange is that a Ranger can't use Missile weapons throughout all his life at all. Why not?

In ancient Thule I don't think they rode many horses anyways, I recall V saying something about this on his old YT channel. However, I suspect you can ride one anyways, you just probably can't do advanced things with it like combat.

Yeah. I was wrong with you can't obtain new Skills after you done your Skill set during a Generation process, because of it my explanations sound so stupid within this context. Nevertheless, if you don't have a Riding Skill your hero isn't able to ride animals. You need to wait for a time when you'll get an opportunity to choose a Riding Skill by a New Level. This is what it is. 

[shameonyou]

Dec 4, 2022 22:24:43 GMT n/a said:

In your post you seem to be suggesting a PC starts as a civilian, gets skills from that class, and then converts to a non-civilian and then gets skills from that.  It's an interesting idea but I don't think that is how it's meant to be used.  Character creation is you pick civilian OR a non-civilian role.  It would be a special case where you start as a civilian and move to a non-civilian role, or a case where you lose your class and become a civilian and somehow regain it again.

Why? Because your class is assigned upon entering manhood after going through the rebirth rites, not before.  A child is not a civilian.  A man is a civilian who does not get a class.  At least that is what I assume.

Maybe I understand it wrongly and when you generate your character he/she isn't even a Civilian (and if so note that you're under a risk to became a complete hero without a 'Stamina'! Because 'Stamina' isn't included in every Skill Set of each Character Role! It's also not necessarily means you can pick 'Stamina' based on a Cultural Background of your birthplace (page 13). Because of it, I think in another way that during a generation your character isn't a pre-character only, but he/she is exact a Civilian. The reason of it is you have more options with Skills and a Civilian Character Role doesn't have any prerequisites. It seems to me the Civilian Character Role is by default. It's like an alternative.). It's just a character without any Character Role including a Civilian Character Role when your generate his/her statistics. Nevertheless, you have 0 Skills at the beginning. If you choose to be a Civilian after you generated your hero it means you'll be a Civilian for all your imagined life. The reason is you can change your Character Role in a game just once in blue Moon. It doesn't happen to characters even sometimes. A possibility to change your Character Role is a truly rare occasion. You also lose your Character Role when you aren't Noble more and that Character Role (what you lost) requires being Noble in relation to a hero. But it's another case, because when your restore your Noble status hence your restore your lost Character Role.



Okay, let's imagine you chosen to be a Civilian after a character generation. It means you can choose four more Skills for this Character Role (a Civilian) and if your New four Skills that you chose coincide with Skills that you already have after generation, so the same New Skills just replaced those Skills of your first choice. As I wrote above you can't have two the same Skills at the same time. I understand Skills of any Character Role Skills Set are already Trained you don't have penalties from them. Other Skills that you obtain in a game (except Skills based on a Cultural Background (page 13)), are Untrained and you have penalties from them.



It looks like there is a pre-character at the background of any Character Role in MYFAROG. Because firstly, you generate a pre-character next you give him/her some Character Role, and it's done. Finally, you have a complete generated hero.

Dammit...I can be wrong with my understandable how a generation happens to your hero. I just write my thoughts about it. Also, I don't just play MYFAROG and I forget details with time. Maybe 'Dodging', 'Perception', 'Tempo' (it seems to be logical too) are your Skills by default, because you're really restricted with your choice. If there is no place even for 'Perception', because you reached your limit with other important Skills, it means you're deaf and blind...it's stupid. At the end of this topic it seems to me 'Dodging', 'Perception', 'Tempo' are always in your Skill Set anyway in spite of there is no words in the text you have some Skills by default. It's as I typed about it in my first post of this topic. 

[shameonyou]

Dec 4, 2022 22:24:43 GMT n/a said:

In your post you seem to be suggesting a PC starts as a civilian, gets skills from that class, and then converts to a non-civilian and then gets skills from that.  It's an interesting idea but I don't think that is how it's meant to be used.  Character creation is you pick civilian OR a non-civilian role.  It would be a special case where you start as a civilian and move to a non-civilian role, or a case where you lose your class and become a civilian and somehow regain it again.

Why? Because your class is assigned upon entering manhood after going through the rebirth rites, not before.  A child is not a civilian.  A man is a civilian who does not get a class.  At least that is what I assume.

P.S. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Man, I'm fed UP OF IT!!!!! 🤣 It makes me complicated. 😭

Look, if you're a Civilian during a character generation it means all your four Skills are Trained, because all Skills of Skill Sets of each Character Role are Trained. Also, every Skill of a Cultural Background is Trained (page 13). Skills that you obtain in game with New Levels are only Untrained.

I hope I explained my thoughts about it clearly for you.

I'm sorry.

[shameonyou]

Check this post 👉  The correct way how to add Skills when you generate a hero! out.